Hi All,
After some troubleshooting, we have determined that the issue with 3D printing is the cold- the contrast between the hot bed (should be slightly hotter than the preset, around 110 degrees apparently) and the cold air is messing with the build in tuning.
According to the internet, we should build a door.
Our solution is below:
I propose building a tea cosy for it, but apparently a box might work as well.
Yay knitting!
What was the problem that you were solving?
Bed adhesion / print warping causing parts to seperate and zoom around the print bed like a cat after a laser pointer.
First layers went down well but de lamination was occurring after warping
Ambient temperature was about 14’c so thermal expansion and contraction was presumably becoming an issue.
Slight increase in bed temperature (90 ->110’c) was only partially effective. (Material was coloured ABS so transition temperature was presumed to be higher). Bed levelling did not seem to be an issue and infill quality was good (near 100% coverage with nice pancaking, level top and no overflow or sagging on overhangs, no print head dragging) and the issues was cropping up when moving to loose infill layers.
Slightly restricting the airflow meant the heated bed quickly warmed the enclosure to about high 20s. There was a constant convection flow out the top and the “cover” did not constrain the mechanism or reach moving parts.
Layers between the print bed and print head presumably cooled slower; Warping solved.
Good investigative work.
However I thought we’d agreed that we wouldn’t use ABS until it could be demonstrated low risk.
ABS usage discussion aside view below.
To print ABS successfully at 90º you’ll need to add ABS juice on the build plate or you have a choice of other adhesive like Wolfbite maybe glue stick or pva glue but havn’t tried those.
There is also proprietary buildplate like buildtak or zebra plate that you can use but this is the pricey option. It is also known that printing ABS in a cold/drafty environment is a bad idea and you found out by trying in space.
The reason to use extra adhesif at 90º is because ABS as a glass transition of 105º and printing it on a surface colder than it’s glass transition will increase the ability to allow material shrinkage leading to warpage.
I will like to remind you guys that you have agreed to use the 3d printer based on the rules define and it said the machine need to be used with PLA as other material havn’t cleared the risk assesement. The building of the cosy become irrelevant if the rules are followed!
I suspect that when printing was complete you’ve unloaded the filament and turned off the machine without flushing the hotend. If yes keep reading If no I apologise for the rant.
Doing this will cause a lot of trouble for the next person using the printer when loading filament. He might even have blockage and filament skipping leading to a lot of troubleshooting to work out why he can’t load the filament. Just a thought!
If the 3D priner gives of very toxic gas and is temperature sensitive why don’t we put it in a simple box with a extract?
Two birds with one stone , although i am dubious about the toxic thing
The enclosure idea is not a bad idea. Let’s be clear we are talking at carbon filter extraction to remove the smell and who knows the level of filtration required to remove the toxicity from the fume. All of this not planned in budget or volunteer to build it.
Following the phase 2 design talk this idea wasn’t proposed, putting the printer in an enclosure with extraction will certainly increase the printer footprint and with so many other proposed idea being canned due to the lack of space I don’t see why a treatment of favor should be applied when the machine usage has not cleared material that have toxic fume or particularly temperature sensitive material also not cleared.
What i have in mind will not take any extra space , and as for the very toxic fumes i think that we are being silly but as we know temperature is very important so we can put it in a box and contact it to the extraction system .
I would like to point out that laptops and pc’s also have been inplicted in sick building syndrome and can generate very toxic chemistry . We should also consider insisting that all electronic equipment is used in fume cupboards .
Its always better to be safe than sorry…
Yes indeed I think we are being silly!
The rules define a specific usage for the machine than why are we still discussing about this?
honestly I think we should just place a common kitchen extractor fan above a work area and **anything ** that may cause a (smell, unknown, if, or maybe) we use it under there to keep everyone happy.
example: https://www.gumtree.com/p/other-ovens-hobs-cookers/kitchen-oven-extractor-fan/1142457433
We are talking about the heat ventilation systems on another thread .
It might be simpler to just supply a gas mask to anyone who spends to much time worrying about it
Thanks
Materials just need a sensible risk assessment.
When we last looked at ABS it was unclear if it was safe to use. The unpleasant smell is entirely separate to health concerns.
Edit: that was over a year ago, IIRC
Based on the SDS most ABS products are fine, however the big issue with filament is that it is near impossible to say that with certainty as all of them have different additives such as colours that mean it isn’t 100% PLA/ABS… This is where there is an issue…
ABS however does cause most people sore throat, and affects breathing in asthmatics.
You are supposed to suffer for your art…
I will bill a box and extract or carbon when we fit out phase 2
We don’t need an extractor, the issue sounds like Rory was using ABS on without glue on the bed.
Thought this article was appropriate to the discussion we are having.
Rant not attacking anyone, just to says what on mind!
As said before, the printer enclosure is a good idea building a box around it might not be the most efficient when you consider scalability just in case we get an other printer but it seems that this decision has already been made, who care right!
I was in the impression that the makerspace is not your own man cave. However a fundamental principle is being broken. The rules and manufacturer manual says that the operating bed temperature can be set from 0º to 100º to resolve a technical difficulty the temperature was set to 110º. This go directly against condition of use of the machine and IF that action will have broken the machine than what next? Your are told not to use a specific material like (e.g. ABS, Carbon Fiber based, whatever really) because it wear out the machine or some other reason but who care as long as your project is completed right. This attitude translate to I give the finger to the community as long as I do what I want or I bully my way to make everyone accept that I will do it anyway when no one is looking.
Are the instruction manual, rules we define and use just a guideline, they obviously seems to be left to the discretion of the members to act on their own judgement to resolve whatever they want.
